my sentiments entirely.Thank you for bringing it up,the man gave Ireland to the roman catholic church,Did he make any Decisions ,of his own while in government?

Hi Geraldine

According to John Cooney's Book on McQuaid ..... He let McQuaid write several of the Articles of Ireland's Constitution ..... without any input from anyone and without any debate in Government. And these Articles were inserted into the Constitution exactly as McQuaid wrote them.

The Knitter

PRESS RELEASE


quote:
“State Recognition that many Religious have been falsely accused of child abuse – and deserve support – Charity Status for L.O.V.E”

Let Our Voices Emerge the group set up to “Support all those claiming false allegations of child abuse against them, including the Religious of Integrity” have been granted official charity status (Charity 16036).
Says an exuberant Florence Horsman Hogan – a founder of L.O.V.E, “although many of our members are lay people (Teachers, Doctors, Nurses, farmers etc.), many are from the Religious Orders. We see this as official recognition that many Religious have been falsely accused – and deserve support”

Florence Horsman Hogan **********
Founder and PRO of L.O.V.E
www.voicesemerge.com Charity 16036


As you look more and more into OUR TIMES in THOSE PLACES the DIMENSIONS EXPAND. What was so UNIQUE about IRELAND that it could produce a CHILD DETENTION system so DEPRAVED and SO EXPORTABLE?

Why is it that when you HEAR and READ of ABOMINATIONS against CHILDREN you discover an IRISH RELIGIOUS ORDER.? Go through the archives of any NEWSPAPER in the ENGLISH SPEAKING WORLD and this FACT will HIT you. AUSTRALIA, NEW ZEALAND, CANADA, the USA, the UK and our DEAR LITTLE ISLAND.

In any ENTERPRISE that PURPORTS to ENHANCE the COMMON GOOD there are CHECKS and BALANCES yet this was SINGULARLY LACKING in OUR SITUATIONS. It was as if they locked us up and threw away the key. Nominally there was OVERSIGHT but it deliberately remained BLIND to our SUFFERINGS. It gave a BLANK CARD to THESE religious ORDERS to exploit us to, and beyond, OUR LIMITS. Is there something in the Irish Psyche that tolerates WHAT WE KNOW HAPPENED?

There is NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in the Irish Psyche that tolerates ABOMINATIONS against the MOST HELPLESS.

What we had in Ireland was corrupt religious leaders blinded by their power and might. Their ambition was to gain in prestige and wealth for their organisation: The Roman Catholic Church is BY FAR the LARGEST landowner on THIS island, the WEALTHIEST organisation on THIS island; So their AMBITION has been STUNNINGLY SUCCESSFUL.

With all such successful enterprises there is a DARK SIDE to this SUCCESS - a price has been paid.

CHILDREN HAVE BEEN RIPPED FROM THEIR KITH AND KIN AND ISOLATED FROM SOCIETY
CHILDREN HAVE BEEN THE VICTIMS OF APPALLING AND DESTRUCTIVE VIOLENCE
CHILDREN HAVE DIED WITHOUT ANY PROPER INQUIRY
CHILDREN HAVE BEEN USED AS FORCED LABOUR
CHILDREN HAVE BEEN CRIMINALISED
CHILDREN HAVE BEEN RAPED
This PRICE is still being PAID by SURVIVORS

Yet the ORGANISATIONS RESPONSIBLE for these CRIMES AGAINST CHILDREN CONTINUE to DEMAND RESPECT from people. Indeed they ACT as if THESE CRIMES were very few AND far between - they issue CYNICAL APOLOGIES - they belittle ADVOCATES for SURVIVORS AND VICTIMS - they secretly ENCOURAGE APOLOGISTS and REVISIONIST to tell OUTRAGEOUS LIES about ROMAN CATHOLIC-MANAGED Child Detention Centres.

These maddeningly CRIMINAL organisations may ACTUALLY believe they are WINNING the BATTLE against SURVIVORS AND VICTIMS ........ but let me tell you something you BLACK-HEARTED BASTARDS:- YOU HAVE ALREADY LOST!

Just want to say to you:- KEEP DIGGING - because I DON'T GIVE A FIDDLER'S FUCK how deep you DIG YOUR HOLE, HELL WAITS FOR YOU - - - - FOR GOOD and FOR EVER.
 

SISTER of MERCY TO TESTIFY

THE biggest religious order in the country, the Sisters of Mercy, will testify for the first time about life in one of their industrial schools when representatives of the congregation appear before the Commission on Child Abuse today. The public hearings will focus on Our Lady of Succour Industrial School, Newtownforbes, Co Longford. The Commission has been conducting both private and public hearings about life in individual residential institutions since last year.

Newtownforbes will be the first institution run by a female religious order to come before the Commission which was set up by the Government to establish the sort of regime that existed in these institutions. In 2002 the Commission, under previous chairperson, Justice Mary Laffoy, angered victim groups when it advertised for those who had positive memory
of their time in Newtownforbes to testify to it.

A Mercy Sister-run orphanage, Goldenbridge, was the first of its kind to be brought to national attention through the 1996 RTE drama/documentary, 'Dear Daughter', which caused a national outcry and helped to lead to the setting up of the Ryan Commission. The Mercy Sisters ran 27 units housing more than 2,500 children in the middle of the last century. In 1971 they were still in charge of 16 Industrial schools but the number of children in the schools had dropped dramatically to 576. Last year the order issued a well-received apology to victims for abuse suffered while in their care.

The apology said to victims: "We have in the past publicly apologised to you. We know that you heard our apology then as conditional and less than complete. Now, without reservation, we apologise to each and every one of you for the suffering we have caused."

However, although the congregation acknowledges that abuse did take place it has found no evidence of such abuse in its files.

David Quinn

I was amazed at the way the religious snipers have attacked Mick Waters on this site, once again it shows the type of snides that they are. The Holy Joe's attack this person about his approach to Abusers of children in the Institutes. While they go on about this man they fail to accept the abuses that was inflicted on this person as a young child suffered in Artane and which he was brave enough to go public about. In all these morons qoutations from newspaper articles they missed Mick's sufferings. You religous freaks failed will pay for your spin very soon, Why? Because Ultimate Disposal.Com is on its way back. So Rory, P'O, Rivers(The Tritity) and the FHH(jOAN Of Arc) will rue the day you choose to make these unwise statements. By the way Rory you have not come back on Father Carney or you side kicks Br.Able and Br, Gordon and what about your little club "Bumblebee"????????????????????????????????????. Martin - ex pupil.

Dear Reverend Mother,

 

I am writing to tell you how very disappointed I was at finding such a lack of supervision in your school during my recent medical examination. I cannot find any excuse which would exonerate you and your staff from the verminous condition of several of the children's head. Then I was not satisfied in finding so many of the girls in the infirmary suffering from bruises on their bodies. I wish particularly to draw attention to the latter as under no circumstances can the Department tolerate treatment of this nature, and you being responsible for the care of these children will have some difficulty in avoiding censure.

The neglect of supervision and individual attention is, in my opinion, the reason for the dirty condition of the heads and the untreated abscesses I discovered in the child in the infirmary. Immediate steps will have to be taken to remedy these obvious defects in the school organisation and in this UNREADABLE I would suggest an increase in the staff of the religious, with stricter supervision.

I regret the necessity of this letter and will expect to see a marked and substantial improvement when the school is next inspected, otherwise I will be reluctantly compelled to take the matter further.

Yours Sincerely,.

 

______________________

Dr. Anna McCabe.

P.S. I did not draw attention before to the unsatisfactory fire precautions."

Brother Coleman, An alleged sexual abuser who was in Artane and other Industrial Schools in Ireland - North and South was found hiding in Northern Ireland in a retirement home for Christian Bros. When the police came for him the Christian Bros had transfered him to Dublin. Now the police in Northern Ireland are having him extradited back. This is to let all Survivors know that this is what the Christian Bros are doing and this is not the first time is it Bros?. My! My! My! was this Bro not brought before the Redress Board by Barney O' Connell? or is Barney misleading Survivors? " Liberty Boy"

Official Letter Condemns Religious Orders

 

 

Gross Malnutrition of Children in Industrial Schools

 

13 Eanar 1945

I.R.226/44,

Runai,
Roinn Airgeadais

I am directed by the Minister for Education to inform you that he is gravely concerned at the evidence which has been reaching him for a considerable time of the malnutrition of children in industrial schools, particularly those for girls and junior boys. Shortly after her appointment in 1939, the Department's Medical Inspector, Dr. McCabe, set about the task of bringing the dietary in these schools up to such a level that the children would thrive on it and put on weight in a normal way. She revised the diet scales in all schools and advised individual schools on the deficiencies in their dietaries. She introduced a system whereby the resident manager of every school is required to keep a medical chart in respect of each child, upon which, inter alia, the weight and height of the child must be entered each quarter. These charts enable the child's progress in weight to be compared with the normal for its age and height.

These and other measures brought about a marked improvement during the early war years. Unfortunately this has not been maintained and the position for some time past has been serious. The Medical Inspector has stated time and again that the general standard of nutrition is too low. This grave state of affairs is due, to a degree which varies with the circumstances of each individual school, to the following causes:

(1) Inability to provide adequate quantities of food owing to the rise in prices;
(2) Failure to do so owing to parsimony; and
(3) Failure to provide a properly balanced diet (even when the quantity is adequate) owing to lack of training in the management of institutions for children and ignorance of fundamental dietetic principles.

As to (1), the payment of the State capitation grant on all committed children (instead of on the "certified number") and the increase from 5s/ - to 7s/6d per week of the State and local authority grants for children under 6, (both changes took effect as from the 1st July last), have done something to ease the schools' financial position. When pressed to improve diet, however, managers complain continually that they cannot afford to do so, or that they can do so only by economising elsewhere e.g. in clothing. The Association of Managers has applied for an emergency bonus of 5s/- per week per child. There is no doubt that the schools, particularly the smaller ones and those that have no farms or very small ones, have a case for an emergency increase in their income (in common with every other section of the community) if they are to be compelled to maintain, and in many cases, to improve upon, their pre-war standards of food and clothing.

As to (2), the strongest possible action has been taken in all cases where the Department was satisfied that parsimony was the predominant cause of gross malnutrition. Two resident managers have been removed from office at the request of the Minister for Education. Others have been solemnly warned and will be removed in due course if there is no adequate improvement. (In one such case in Co. Cork the warning was given personally by the Secretary to the Department accompanied by the Inspector of Reformatory and Industrial Schools.)

As to (3), this is a contributory cause of malnutrition in all schools, particularly those conducted by nuns, and an effort to eradicate it is an essential part of the general attack on malnutrition. It is proposed to have a course in institutional management and UNREADABLE next summer and to invite the sister or sisters in charge of the catering in each of the 43 schools conducted by nuns to attend. The City of Dublin Vocational Committee will be asked to conduct the course in Colaiste Muire le Tigheas, Cathal Brugha Street, and to make available the services of professors on their staff who are highly skilled in these subjects. From preliminary discussions between officers of the Committee and the Department it has been ascertained that the course could be specially framed framed to suit the actual conditions existing in the schools. It would deal with the fundamentals of institutional cookery as applied to industrial school needs. Practical training in essential {processes} and dishes would be given and particular attention would be paid to methods of serving large quantities of food. There would also be lectures on the economic planning of menus in accordance with dietetic needs, on costing, storage, and preparation of foodstuffs. In addition, the Department's Medical Inspector would avail of the opportunity to give some lectures on balance in diet, hygiene, etc,. The course should last for four weeks.

Having regard to the background out of which this proposal emerges - persistent pressure by the Department on the schools to spend more money on food and constant complaints from the schools that they cannot afford to do so - it will be clear that the course must not involve the schools in any expense if there is to be a reasonable prospect of securing their co-operation. It is proposed to make a grant of 9 (nine pounds) towards the expenses of each nun from a school outside Dublin City who attends the course - 2 pounds for travelling expenses, 6 pounds for four weeks hostel expenses in Dublin, and 1 pound for materials and part maintenance (they will eat meals they prepare). Nuns from Dublin City schools would receive the grant of 1 pound only.

The estimated cost of the course is as follows:
Instruction:
1 Teacher at 40 pounds = 40 pounds
2 Asst. Teachers at 30 pounds each = 60 pounds
Attendants and rent = 15 pounds

Travelling and subsistence
Say 50 nuns at 9 pounds each= 450 pounds
Total: 565 pounds

The figure might be rounded up to 600 pounds to cover the possibility of a greater attendance than now anticipated. This amount could be provided in a new subhead B1 in Vote 50 entitled "Summer course in institutional management for members of communities conducting industrial and reformatory schools for girls"

I am to request the sanction of the Minister for Finance for the conduct of this course and the inclusion of provision accordingly in Vote 50 for 1945/46

Leas Runai

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The Knitter Comments

We are being asked to participate in a farce with the revelation of this letter by the Department for Education.  The Department are asking us to believe that they, in the person of Dr. McCabe, were concerned about our welfare. In particular our nutrition.  But the Department FAILS to mention that most of the religious orders "managing" the Institutions were ALREADY MANAGING, very successfully too, SECONDARY SCHOOLS and BOARDING SCHOOLS. Why the fuck would these religious orders need a course in Institutional Management and Catering?  What EXACTLY about the CARE OF CHILDREN and  THE NUTRITIONAL NEEDS OF CHILDREN did these religious orders NOT UNDERSTAND - hadn't these religious orders been looking after the needs of children in their SECONDARY SCHOOLS AND BOARDING SCHOOLS since before the foundation of the State?  Why were NO QUESTIONS on this matter ASKED of the representative of the Sisters of Mercy during her recent "CHAT" at the RYAN "investigation"? 

It now appears that the "Ryan Commission" have told Survivors that they can give evidence on St Patricks - Killkenny if they want as this is a chance to speak of their childhood spent in this place. This CLOWN has told Survivors that they will not be called to give evidence with regards to other Institutes that they were in, as a Survivor can not appear at the Commission twice. Who does this person think he is fooling because under Irish Law and Irish Constitution a person age ten or under can not give evidence to any tribunals or bodies set up to investigate or to carry out an inquiry. So any evidence given at such hearings can be dismissed on these grounds and also this is the reason that they would never listen to us as children as to the abuses that we were made to suffer as children in these places. The law is an ass and so is this JudgrRyan fellow. Be warned that some solicitors are trying to encourage Survivors to attend this "Comedy Show" in order to make money out of us. Survivors from St.Patricks are been asked to attend this Laugh-in on Feb 5th 2005 in Dublin. Why are the Commission putting Goldenbridge and Artane on the back burner? The deaths of a young girl in Goldenbridge and the death of Patsy Flannagan in Artane are the reason why. Liberty Boy

I have just "retrieved" a document relating to St. Patrick's in Kilkenny [a sisters of charity gulag] and it contains the names and dates of "admissions" and "discharges" to and from the gulag in one year (1957/58) and in that time, sadly, only one child was released to his mother. Only One Child Went Home.

In Sisters of Mercy Secondary Schools and Boarding Schools during the 30's, 40's, 50's, & 60's et al GUESS WHAT WAS ON THE SYLLABUS of these POSH institutions ? .... YES .... HOME ECONOMICS ....................... fucking home economics!!! What the FUCK would this religious order need of an INSTITUTIONAL MANAGEMENT COURSE. In Sisters of Mercy Primary Schools you actually studied HOME ECONOMICS so when you went on to their POSH schools you did Advanced HOME ECONOMICS.

WHY hasn't anyone, ANYONE, asked the representative of this religious order how they could STARVE - ILL-TREAT & BRUTALISE one set of children and YET another set of children can have the knowledge of HOME ECONOMICS passed onto them by a religious order whom the State, represented by the Education Department, feels should sit a EDUCATION COURSE in CATERING FOR THE NUTRITIONAL NEEDS OF CHILDREN.

Investigation Committee – Programme of Work for 2005

1. This document sets out the Committee’s plans for proceeding with its inquiry function in light of statements made in 2004.

2. In restarting the inquiry into child abuse and conducting our hearings to date, we have borne in mind the proposals for amendment that we are making so as not to take steps that will have to be undone later. We understand that an amending Bill will be introduced early in the New Year.

3. The Investigation Committee cannot at present decide to conclude an investigation into a particular institution, even if it is satisfied that sufficient witnesses have been heard. The reason is that it could be contended that people who have not been called for hearing were still entitled to tell their stories to the Committee. If amending legislation did not come into effect, the Investigation Committee would have to arrange to hear further witnesses. This issue has been discussed in previous reports and statements.

4. As the Committee announced in June 2004, it is going to hear as many witnesses as are required in order to conduct the inquiry. We do not intend to hear in full session every witness in respect of each institution because that is not necessary and it would not allow us to report as early as possible.

5. We are going to interview every one of the people (approximately 1,300) who decided to continue participating in the inquiry by the Investigation Committee. This process will be conducted by members of our legal team. The detailed information obtained in these interviews will be collected in databases and produced in report format which will then be distributed as appropriate to relevant bodies for comment and discussion. If there are material areas of dispute, the Committee will arrange for further investigation, including full hearings if appropriate, held in public where possible.

6. In the interview process, witnesses whose experience is required to be investigated further by the Committee will be chosen for later appearance before the Committee in full session with cross-examination taking place. With smaller institutions, a very high proportion of complainants will go through the two processes, namely, interview and adversarial hearing. Not all witnesses in the biggest institutions will go to full adversarial hearing but everybody will be interviewed. The result will be that everybody will either be interviewed as described or will go to full adversarial hearing and many will have both. In the case of institutions where hearings have already taken place the legal team will interview all the remaining witnesses who have not been before the Committee.


7. The scheme that we are putting in place has a number of functions: -

(a) The Investigation Committee will have the opportunity to gather a body of evidence at first hand from all the people who want to continue with the Committee, thus ensuring that every single person has a role in the work of the inquiry;
( It will enable the Committee through its legal team to ensure that the witnesses who are put forward for participation in the full hearing process represent the range of experiences across time in the particular institution;
(c) It will reduce the likelihood of people who are less able for full adversarial hearings being subjected to examination and cross-examination before gatherings of lawyers and other interested parties;
(d) It will yield information across institutions under investigation;
(e) The information will be gathered in a formal process of interview so as to enable specific topics to be examined; and
(f) Comparisons between institutions will be made easier.

8. The Committee will hear as much evidence as is necessary in the adversarial hearings in order to conduct its investigation. In previous documents, notably in the statement of the Chairperson to the meeting of the Investigation Committee in public in the Shelbourne Hotel on 7th May 2004, it was made clear that the Committee could not set out to hear every possible witness in its contentious hearings. At that time, we had not devised the procedure of hearing every witness in the way that we are now describing and this represents a big step forward in assuring all those who want to assist in the Committee’s proceedings that they can do so.

9. The Committee is engaging experts to assist its inquiry as announced on 7th May. There are issues that span across all institutions or many of them and which are best explored in the first instance by experts. For example many witnesses complain that they were given insufficient food and facilities in the institution. So levels of finance and the utilisation of resources have to be examined. The best way of doing this is to engage expert financial consultants to prepare reports on the issues having explored the questions in consultation with the different institutions and the State and having analysed relevant documents. The reports of the experts will then be distributed to the relevant people who are affected by the contents and debated as appropriate before the Committee so that findings can be made.

10. Experts in other areas will be engaged on a similar basis. The advantages are considerable:

- the inquiry is focussed; (sic)
- relevant matters are investigated by people with expertise in that area;
- matters not in dispute can be identified and summarised for the IC; and
- matters remaining in dispute can be identified more efficiently and presented to the IC for resolution.

Such a scheme is particularly appropriate to issues which are “horizontal” that is, which are spread across the institutions rather than those which are “vertical” arising in respect of a particular institution only. The institutions have the reassurance that their affairs are being examined by qualified experts.

11. Our programme for 2005 is broadly as follows:

· Interviews with all witnesses
· Expert investigations
· Public hearings for introductory phases of institutions
· Private hearings

---

12. The next institutions to be investigated are:

Our Lady of Succour, Newtownforbes ...... this week
St Patrick’s Industrial School, Kilkenny ...... February
St Vincent’s Industrial School, Goldenbridge ?
St. Conleth's Reformatory School, Daingean ?
St. Joseph's Industrial School, Letterfrack ?
St Joseph’s Industrial School, Kilkenny ?
Artane Industrial School ?

Maybe Ryan could do st pats kilkenny between 8.30 and 9am, goldenbridge between 9.30 and 10am, daingean between 11.30am and 12noon, Letterfrack between 2.30 and 3.00pm , these are just suggestions Judge Ryan and I have no intentions of trying to increse your very heavy workload ..... But, and i'm sure you've thought of this, you could do all these places during your lunch break and still have time to improve on your (absymal) golf handicap.

Is it true that 8 people from florences old school have received money from the redress board. Doesnt that beat all. I think florence should make a statement on wether thats true. Come on pet say something.

 ARTANE

EXCERPT FROM Fr. Moore's Report to Archbishop McQuaid on the Conditions in Artane in 1962

......The boys are badly clothed. They have no overcoats unless they can pay for them out of their pocket-money. They have no vests and no change of footwear or socks; sometimes a boys shoes are too small and give him sore feet. They have no handkerchiefs. There is no such thing as a boy having his own shirt or pyjamas - after washing, articles of clothing are distributed at random; Bed clothes are inadequate. The boys are undernourished.

The medical facilities are appalling. There is no resident nurse or matron. The Brother who is in charge of the infirmary has no experience of nursing - he used to be employed on the farm. The surgical room is unsuitable for the purpose [infirmary] and the room smells......